Petter Reinholdtsen: Time to find a new laptop, as the old one is broken after only two years

15th April 2015

It was a surprise to me to learn that project to create a complete -computer system for schools I've involved in, -Debian Edu / Skolelinux, was -being used in India. But apparently it is, and I managed to get an -interview with one of the friends of the project there, Shirish -Agarwal.

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Who are you, and how do you spend your days?

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My name is Shirish Agarwal. Based out of the educational and -historical city of Pune, from the western state of Maharashtra, India. -My bread comes from giving training, giving policy tips, -installations on free software to mom and pop shops in different -fields from Desktop publishing to retail shops as well as work with -few software start-ups as well.

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How did you get in contact with the Skolelinux / Debian Edu -project?

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It started innocently enough. I have been using Debian for a few -years and in one local minidebconf / debutsav I was asked if there was -anything for schools or education. I had worked / played with free -educational softwares such as Gcompris and Stellarium for my many -nieces and nephews so researched and found Debian Edu or Skolelinux as -it was known then. Since then I have started using the various -education meta-packages provided by the project.

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What do you see as the advantages of Skolelinux / Debian -Edu?

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It's closest I have seen where a package full of educational -software are packed, which are free and open (both literally and -figuratively). Even if I take the simplest software which is -gcompris, the number of activities therein are amazing. Another one of -the softwares that I have liked for a long time is stellarium. Even -pysycache is cool except for couple of issues I encountered -#781841 and -#781842.

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I prefer software installed on the system over web based solutions, -as a web site can disappear any time but the software on disk has the -possibility of a larger life span. Of course with both it's more a -question if it has enough users who make it fun or sustainable or both -for the developer per-se.

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What do you see as the disadvantages of Skolelinux / Debian -Edu?

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I do see that the Debian Edu team seems to be short-handed and I -think more efforts should be made to make it popular and ask and take -help from people and the larger community wherever possible.

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I don't see any disadvantage to use Skolelinux apart from the fact -that most apps. are generic which is good or bad how you see it. -However, saying that I do acknowledge the fact that the canvas is -pretty big and there are lot of interesting ideas that could be done -but for reasons not known not done or if done I don't know about them. -Let me share some of the ideas (these are more upstream based but -still) I have had for a long time :

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1. Classical maths question of two trains in opposing directions -each running @x kmph/mph at y distance, when they will meet and how -far would each travel and similar questions like these. - -

The computer is a fantastic system where questions like these can -be drawn, animated and the methodology and answers teased out in -interactive manner. While sites such as the -Ask -Dr. Math FAQ on The Two Trains problem (as an example or point of -inspiration) can be used there is lot more that can be done. I dunno -if there is a free software which does something like this. The idea -being a blend of objects + animation + interaction which does -this. The whole interaction could be gamified with points or sounds or -colourful celebration whenever the user gets even part of the question -or/and methodology right. That would help reinforce good behaviour. -This understanding could be used to share/showcase everything from how -the first wheel came to be, to evolution to how astronomy started, -psychics and everything in-between.

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One specific idea in the train part was having the Linux mascot on -one train and the BSD or GNU mascot on the other train and they -meeting somewhere in-between. Characters from blender movies could -also be used.

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2. Loads of crossword-puzzles with reference to subjects: We have -enormous data sets in Wikipedia and Wikitionary. I don't think it -should be a big job to design crossword puzzles. Using categories and -sub-categories it should be doable to have Q&A single word answers -from the existing data-sets. What would make it easy or hard could be -the length of the word + existence of many or few vowels depending on -the user's input.

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3. Jigsaw puzzles - We already have a great software called -palapeli with number of slicers making it pretty interesting. What -needs to be done is to download large number of public domain and -copyleft images, tease and use IPTC tags to categorise them into -nature, history etc. and let it loose. This could turn to be really -huge collection of images. One source could be taken from -commons.wikimedia.org, others could be huge collection of royalty-free -stock photos. Potential is immense.

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Apart from this, free software suffers in two directions, we lag -both in development (of using new features per-se) and maintenance a -lot. This is more so in educational software as these applications -need to be timely and the opportunity cost of missing deadlines is -immense. If we are able to solve issues of funding for development and -maintenance of such software I don't see any big difficulties. I know -of few start-ups in and around India who would love to develop and -maintain such software if funding issues could be solved.

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Which free software do you use daily?

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That would be huge list. Some of the softwares are obviously apt, -aptitude, debdelta, leafpad, the shell of course (zsh nowadays), -quassel for IRC. In games I use shisen-sho while card-games are evenly -between kpat and Aiselriot. In desktops it's a tie between -gnome-flashback and mate.

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Which strategy do you believe is the right one to use to -get schools to use free software?

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I think it should first start with using specific FOSS apps. in -whatever environment they are. If it's MS-Windows or Mac so be it. -Once they are habitual with the apps. and there is buy-in from the -school management then it could be installed anywhere. Most of the -people now understand the concept of a repository because of the -various online stores so it isn't hard to convince on that front.

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What is harder is having enough people with technical skills and -passion to service them. If you get buy-in from one or two teachers -then ideas like above could also be asked to be done as a project as -well.

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I think where we fall short more than anything is in marketing. For -instance, Debian has this whole range of fonts in its archive but -there isn't even a page where all those different fonts in the La -Ipsum format could be tried out for newcomers.

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One of the issues faced constantly in installations is with updates -and upgrades. People have this myth that each update and upgrade -means the user interface will / has to change. I have seen this -innumerable times. That perhaps is one of the reasons which browsers -like Iceweasel / Firefox change user interfaces so much, not because -it might be needed or be functional but because people believe that -changed user interfaces are better. This, can easily be pointed with -the user interfaces changed with almost every MS-Windows and Mac OS -releases.

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The problems with Debian Edu for deployment are many. The biggest -is the huge gap between what is taught in schools and what Debian Edu -is aimed at. - -

Me and my friends did teach on week-ends in a government school for -around 2 years, and -gathered -some experience there. Some of the things we learnt/discovered -there was :

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Most of the teachers are very territorial about their subjects - and they do not want you to teach anything out of the - portion/syllabus given.
They want any activity on the system in accordance to whatever - is in the syllabus.
There are huge barriers both with the English language and at - times with objects or whatever. An example, let's say in gcompris - you have objects falling down and you have to name them and let's - say the falling object is a hat or a fedora hat, this would not be - as recognizable as say a - Puneri - Pagdi so there is need to inject local objects, words wherever - possible. Especially for word-games there are so many hindi words - which have become part of english vocabulary (for instance in - parley), those could be made into a hinglish collection or - something but that is something for upstream to do.

- - - Tags: debian edu, english, intervju. - - -

@@ -1337,7 +1182,7 @@ there was :

+ Petter Reinholdtsen + +

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