I går ble jeg kontaktet på epost av -digi.nos Eirik Rossen som lurte på om -jeg hadde noen kommentarer til -kartverkets -pressemelding om Norges tetplassering når det gjelder -kart-tilgjengelighet. Jeg svarte følgende, som resulterte i noen -sitater i -Digis -dekning av kartverkets pressemelding.
- --+Takk for muligheten til å kommentere.
- -Pressemeldingen omhandler tilgjengeligheten av kart for aktører som er -medlem i kartellet Norge Digitalt. Det er ingen overraskelse for meg -at tilgjengeligheten til kart hos disse medlemmene er god. Men for -oss på utsiden av kartellet er tilgjengelighet av det som burde være -felleskapets og innbyggernes kart dårlig.
- -Bruksvilkårene til kartene fra medlemmene i Norge Digital hindrer -nyskapning og selv om en er villig til å betale den ublu prisen som -forlanges får en fortsatt ikke tilgang til kartdata uten -bruksbegresninger. Derfor bruker jeg heller tid på å gjøre -fribrukskartet OpenStreetmap bedre. Der fremmer bruksvilkårene -nyskapning og lar meg skape nye tjenester uten å måtte søke om -tillatelse fra det offentlige.
- -En annen problemstilling er jo sikkerhet til fjells og til sjøs. -Mon tro hvor mange ulykker på sjøen som kunne vært unngått hvis -sjøkartdata var tilgjengelig uten bruksbegrensninger, slik at enhver -med GPS eller kartplotter tilnærmet kostnadsfritt kunne sikre seg mest -mulig oppdaterte sjøkart? Det hjelper jo ikke at offentlige etater -har enkel tilgang til sjøkartene når det samme ikke gjelder hver -båtkaptein og småbåtfører. Jeg tror samfunnet som helhet hadde tjent -på å unngå kostnadene ved disse ulykkene ved å tvinge sjøkartverket -til å publisere sine kartdata på Internet uten bruksbegresninger.
-
A few days ago my color calibration gadget +ColorHug arrived in the +mail, and I've had a few days to test it. As all my machines are +running Debian Squeeze, where +the +calibration software is missing (it is present in Wheezy and Sid), +I ran the calibration using the Fedora based live CD. This worked +just fine. So far I have only done the quick calibration. It was +slow enough for me, so I will leave the more extensive calibration for +another day.
+ +After calibration, I get a +ICC color +profile file that can be passed to programs understanding such +tools. KDE do not seem to understand it out of the box, so I searched +for command line tools to use to load the color profile into X. +xcalib was the first one I found, and it seem to work fine for single +monitor setups. But for my video player, a laptop with a flat screen +attached, it was unable to load the color profile for the correct +monitor. After searching a bit, I +discovered +that the dispwin tool from the argyll package would do what I wanted, +and a simple
+ ++dispwin -d 1 profile.icc ++ +
later I had the color profile loaded for the correct monitor. The +result was a bit more pink than I expected. I guess I picked the +wrong monitor type for the "led" monitor I got, but the result is good +enough for now.
It has been a few busy weeks for me, but I am finally back to -publish another interview with the people behind -Debian Edu and Skolelinux. -This time it is one of our German developers, who have helped out over the -years to make sure both a lot of major but also a lot of the minor -details get right before release. - -
Who are you, and how do you spend your days?
- -My name is Jürgen Leibner, I'm 49 years old and living in -Bielefeld, a town in northern Germany. I worked nearly 20 years as -certified engineer in the department for plant design and layout of an -international company for machinery and equipment. Since 2011 I'm a -certified technical writer (tekom e.V.) and doing technical -documentations for a steam turbine manufacturer. From April this year -I will manage the department of technical documentation at a -manufacturer of automation and assembly line engineering.
- -My first contact with linux was around 1993. Since that time I used -it at work and at home repeatedly but not exclusively as I do now at -home since 2006.
- -How did you get in contact with the Skolelinux/Debian Edu -project?
- -Once a day in the early year of 2001 when I wanted to fetch my -daughter from primary school, there was a teacher sitting in the -middle of 20 old computers trying to boot them and he failed. I helped -him to get them booting. That was seen by the school director and she -asked me if I would like to manage that the school gets all that old -computers in use. I answered: "Yes".
- -Some weeks later every of the 10 classrooms had one computer -running Windows98. I began to collect old computers and equipment as -gifts and installed the first computer room with a peer-to-peer -network. I did my work at school without being payed in my spare time -and with a lot of fun. About one year later the school was connected -to Internet and a local area network was installed in the school -building. That was the time to have a server and I knew it must be a -Linux server to be able to fulfil all the wishes of the teachers and -being able to do this in a transparent and economic way, without extra -costs for things like licence and software. So I searched for a -school server system running under Linux and I found a couple of -people nearby who founded 'skolelinux.de'. It was the Skolelinux -prerelease 32 I first tried out for being used at the school. I -managed the IT of that school until the municipal authority took over -the IT management and centralised the services for all schools in -Bielefeld in December of 2006.
- -What do you see as the advantages of Skolelinux/Debian -Edu?
- -When I'm looking back to the beginning, there were other advantages -for me as today.
- -In the past there were advantages like:
- --
-
-
- I don't need to buy it so it generates no costs to the school as -they had little money to spent for computers and software. - -
- It has a licence which grands all rights to use it without -cost. - -
- It was more able to fit all requirements of a server system for -schools than a Microsoft server system, even if there are only Windows -clients because of it's preconfigured overall concept of being a -infrastructure solution and community for schools, not only a -server - -
- I was able to configure the server to the needs of the -school. - -
Today some of the advantages has been lost, changed or new ones -came up in this way:
- --
-
-
- Most schools here do have money to buy hardware and software -now. - -
- They are today mostly managed from central IT departments which -have own concepts which often do not fit to Debian Edu concepts -because they are to close to Microsoft ideology. - -
- With the Squeeze version of Debian Edu which now uses GOsa² for -management I feel more able to manage the daily tasks than with the -interfaces used in the past. - -
- It is more modular than in the past and fits even better to the -different needs. - -
- The documentation is usable and gets better every day. - -
- More people than ever before are using Debian Edu all over the -world and so the community, which is an very important part I think, -is sharing knowledge and minds. - -
- Most, maybe all, of the technical requirements for schools are -solved today by Debian Edu. - -
What do you see as the disadvantages of Skolelinux/Debian -Edu?
- --
-
-
- There are too few IT companies able to integrate Debian Edu into -their product portfolio for serving schools with concepts or even -whole municipality areas. - -
- Debian Edu has beside other free and open software projects not -enough lobbyists which promote free and open software to -politicians. - -
- Technically there are no disadvantages I'm aware of. - -
Det finnes i følge de som har talt ca. 1600 bensinstasjoner i +Norge. Daglig innsamling av informasjon fra alle disse vil antagelig +kreve noen tusen frivillige. Dugnadsbasert innsamling av bensinpriser +for å gjøre det enklere å sammenligne priser og dermed bedre +konkurransen i bensinmarkedet er en idé som mange har gjennomført de +siste årene. Her er et forsøk på en oversikt over de som finnes i +dag.
+ +-
+
+
- Dinside.no nettside + +
- Nettavisen dinside startet for noen år siden en dugnad for å +samle +inn drivstoffpriser. Tjenesten samler inn med et nettsideskjema +der en må registrere seg for å delta. En SMS-tjeneste har visst +eksistert tidligere, men er ute av drift 2012-05-31. Listen over +bensinstasjoner er kun tilgjengelig for registrerte brukere, og +mangler geografiske koordinater for fremvisning på kart. Listen over +innsamlede bensinpriser er tilgjengelig som nettside i litt over 24 +timer etter registrering. Antall innsamlede priser pr. dag ligger i +området 10-35, og jeg har startet på +en +database over de publiserte prisene hos Scraperwiki. + +
- Bitfactorys mobilapp + +
- I fjor lanserte +selskapet Bitfactory +sin landsdekkende mobilapp (først for iphone, siden også for +Android) for å samle inn drivstoffpriser og gjøre det enkelt å finne +billigste stasjon i nærområdet ved hjelp av smarttelefon. Den +innsamlede informasjonen er ikke publisert på web, men dagens priser +kan hentes ut ved hjelp av et +web-API +som jeg har dokumentert med reversutvikling. Stasjonslisten +inneholder geografiske koordinater for fremvisning på kart. Antall +innsamlede priser pr. dag ser ut til å ligge rundt 200. + + + +
- NAF Bergens nettside og iphone-app + +
- I år lanserte NAF Bergen en +landsdekkende iphone-app koblet til NAF Bergens tjeneste for å +samle inn og varsle brukerne om bensinpriser. Nettstedet har +publisert listen over bensinstasjoner, men ikke en komplett oversikt +over innsamlede priser. De har interessant statistikk over +prisutviklingen som går tilbake til 2009. + +
- bensinpris.net + +
- Nettside med prisinformasjon for Trondheimsområdet. Informasjonen +registreres via web og SMS, og krever ikke registrering. Nettsiden +viser de tre siste prisene registret for bensin og disel. Har liste +over kjente stasjoner tilgjengelig. Svært lite oppdatert for +tiden. + +
I tillegg er jeg kjent med drivstoffguiden.no som ser ut til å være +nedlagt, og at SSB som del av beregningen av konsumprisindeksen samler +inn driftstoffpriser hver måned og +legger dem ut i +PDF-format.
+ +Det jeg ikke forstår er hvorfor det stadig opprettes nye nett- og +mobiltjenester for å samle inn bensinpriser, i stedet for å samarbeide +med de eksisterende løsninger for å gjøre de gode nok til nye +bruksområder. Jobben med å samle inn priser er formidabel, og hvis +målet er bedre konkurranse på bensinmarkedet ville jeg tro det beste +var om kundene samlet seg om _ett_ nettsted og samlet alle prisene +der, i stedet for å spre innsatsen på mange nettsteder. Jeg mistenker +årsaken ligger i at de aktørene som har satt opp tjenester så langt +ikke har lagt opp til deling og samarbeid på like vilkår med andre +aktører, og dermed gjort det vanskelig å legge til funksjonalitet som +presentasjon på kart, statistisk analyse eller kvalitetssikring av +bensinstasjonslisten og prisinformasjonen.
-Which free software do you use daily?
+Tjeneste | +Offentlig stasjons-liste | +Publisert stasjons-geopunkt | +Publisert API for inn-legging | +Publisert API for ut-henting | +Publisert alle priser | +Publisert database | +Lands-dekkende | +
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Dinside | +(ja) | +nei | +nei | +nei | +ja | +(ja) | +ja | +
Bitfactorys mobilapp | +nei | +ja | +(ja) | +(ja) | +nei | +nei | +ja | +
drivstoffpriser.no | +ja | +ja | +nei | +nei | +nei | +nei | +ja | +
bensinpris.net | +ja | +nei | +nei | +nei | +nei | +nei | +nei | +
Which strategy do you believe is the right one to use to -get schools to use free software?
+Dinside mangler dugnadsbasert kvalitetssikring av stasjonslista, +georeferert informasjon og API for innlegging og uthenting av +informasjon. Bitfactory mangler publisering av all innsamlet +informasjon, dugnadsbasert kvalitetssikring av stasjonslista og +dokumentert API for innlegging og uthenting av informasjon. NAFs +løsning mangler publisering av all innsamlet informasjon og API for +innlegging og uthenting av informasjon.
-I believe, we should provide concepts for IT companies to integrate -Debian Edu into their product portfolio with use cases for different -countries and areas all over the world.
+Jeg har nylig spurt folkene bak dinside.nos oversikt og +drivstoffpriser.no om de er villige til å gi ut sine innsamlede data +uten bruksbegresninger og tilby et dokumentert og publisert API for å +legge inn og hente ut informasjon. Så får vi se hva de sier.
Peter Hidas fra Gartner melder i Computerworld at -Unix -nedkjempes av Linux og Windows. For meg er påstanden meningsløs, -da Linux er en variant av Unix, og hele diskusjonen om Linux er Unix -eller ikke er utdatert og uinteressant. Jeg ser at Helge Skrivervik -deler mitt syn på saken i sin kommentar fra i går om at -"Unix vs. Linux -= uinteressant".
- -I NUUG-sammenheng møter jeg av og -til folk som tror NUUG er for avdankede folk som driver med den samme -Unix-varianten som Peter Hidas skriver om i sin kommentar, og dermed -er en foreningen for avdankede teknologer interessert i døende -teknologi. Intet kunne være lengre fra sannheten.
- -NUUG er en forening for oss som har sans for fri programvare, åpne -standarder og Unix-lignende operativsystemer, som Ubuntu, FreeBSD, -Debian, Mint, Gentoo, Android, Gnome, KDE, LXDE, Firefox, LibreOffice, -ODF, HTML, C++, ECMA-Script, etc. Kort sagt der nyskapning skjer på -IT-fronten i dag. Det innebærer selvfølgelig også de som er -interessert i de "gamle" Unix-ene som Solaris og HP-UX, men de er bare -et lite mindretall blant NUUGs medlemmer. De aller fleste medlemmene -har i dag fokus på Linux.
+En god og offentlig kilde til bensinpriser i Norge er +dinside.no +sin prisoversikt samlet inn på dugnad fra frivillige over hele +landet. Den har ikke like mange priser rapportert inn som Bitfactorys +mobil-app, men informasjonen som samles inn er enkelt offentlig +tilgjengelig på web. Dessverre forsvinner prisene fra web etter noen +dager, så for å kunne lage analyser og se trender må en lage en +database ved å hente ut informasjon fra dinside.no sine nettsider over +en lengre periode. Jeg startet for litt over en uke siden en +innsamlingstjeneste som gjør nettopp dette. Jeg har de siste ukene +lært meg å bruke Scraperwiki, +et nytt og nyttig verktøy for å hente ut og strukturere informasjon +tilgjengelig fra nettsider, PDF-er og andre kilder og som trenger +strukturering. Hvis du vil se hvordan prisene har utviklet seg, ta en +titt på +scraperwiki-siden +med databasen over bensinpriser. Den henter ned priser fra +dinside.no hver time. Hvis du vil bidra til å bedre oversikt over +bensinprisene i Norge +registrer +deg hos dinside.no og legg inn prisene fra dine lokale +bensinstasjoner.
+ +Jeg har kun gjort dette med informasjonen fra dinside.no og ikke +informasjonen fra Bitfactory pga. bekymring rundt opphavsrettslige +problemstillinger. Faktainformasjonen samlet inn av brukerene av +dinside.no nettsider er åpenbart publisert offentlig, mens jeg +mistenker det er en juridisk gråsone om det samme gjelder +informasjonen samlet inn av brukerne av bitfactorys mobilapp. Derfor +bidrar jeg med å samle inn priser hos dinside.no, og anbefaler andre å +gjøre det samme. Jeg prioriterer å bidra hos de som forstår verdien +av å dele informasjon med andre uten bruksbegresninger.
In january, I -discovered -the ColorHug, a USB dongle from -Hughski to calibrate -the color on a computer screen. The software required is -included -in Debian, and I decided back then to preorder from the next -batch. Yesterday I finally heard back from them, and got the -opportunity to order. Today I ordered mine, and eagerly await the -delivery. I hope it arrive next week, as I got a confirmation that it -should go in the mail on monday. :)
+I fjor lanserte Bitfactory en +mobilapp for å få +tilgang til bensinpriser på landets bensinstasjoner ved å samle +inn prisene på dugnad ved hjelp av mobilapp-ens brukere. +Informasjonen app-ens brukere har samlet inn har så langt kun vært +tilgjengelig for brukerne av app-ene, og API for å hente ut +informasjonen fra andre plattformer har ikke vært publisert. Da +løsningen kom spurte jeg utviklerne om de kunne publisere +API-dokumentasjon og de skulle se på saken, men det har ikke skjedd så +langt. Jeg antar de har vært for travelt opptatt til å publisere +API-dokumentasjon.
-If you want to ensure the colors on the screen match the intended -colors, I suggest you check out this cheap tool with free software -drivers. :)
+Utrolig nok er det i følge +Dagens +Næringsliv og +Finnmark +Dagblad bensinstasjoner som nekter å oppgi prisene sine på +telefon, slik at det ikke finnes en fornuftig måte å få tak i prisene +på uten å samle dem inn på stedet. Flere har dugnader på gang for å +samle inn prisinformasjon om bensin, men så vidt jeg kan se er det kun +dinside.no +og Bitfactorys App som får regelmessige oppdateringer. Dinsides +oversikt er tilgjengelig på web for de som vil følge med, mens +bitfactorys informasjon ikke er like enkelt tilgjengelig.
-
In 2003, a German teacher showed up on the +Debian Edu and Skolelinux +mailing list with interesting problems and reports proving he setting +up Linux for a (for us at the time) lot of pupils. His name was Ralf +Gesellensetter, and he has been an important tester and contributor +since then, helping to make sure the +Debian Edu +Squeeze release became as good as it is..
+ +Who are you, and how do you spend your days?
+ +I am a teacher from Germany, and my subjects are Geography, +Mathematics, and Computer Science ("Informatik"). During the past 12 +years (since 2000), I have been working for a comprehensive (and soon, +also inclusive) school leading to all kind of general levels, such as +O- or A-level ("Abitur"). For quite as long, I've been taking care of +our computer network.
+ +Now, in my early 40s, I enjoy the privilege of spending a lot of my +spare time together with my wife, our son (3 years) and our daughter +(4 months).
+ +How did you get in contact with the Skolelinux/Debian Edu +project?
+ +We had tried different Linux based school servers, when members of +my local Linux User Group (LUG OWL) detected Skolelinux. I remember +very well, being part of a party celebrating the Linux New Media Award +("Best Newcomer Distribution", also nominated: Ubuntu) that was given +to Skolelinux at Linux World Exposition in Frankfurt, 2005 (IIRC). Few +months later, I had the chance to join a developer meeting in Ulsrud +(Oslo) and to hand out the award to Knut Yrvin and others. For more +than 7 years, Skolelinux is part of our schools infrastructure, namely +our main server (tjener), one LTSP (today without thin clients), and +approximately 50 work stations. Most of these have the option to boot a +locally installed Skolelinux image. As a consequence, I joined quite +a few events dealing with free software or Linux, and met many Debian +(Edu) developers. All of them seemed quite nice and competent to me, +one more reason to stick to Skolelinux.
+ +What do you see as the advantages of Skolelinux/Debian +Edu?
+ +Debian driven, you are given all the advantages of a community +project including well maintained updates. Once, you are familiar with +the network layout, you can easily roll out an entire educational +computer infrastructure, from just one installation media. As only +free software (FOSS) is used, that supports even elderly hardware, +up-sizing your IT equipment is only limited by space (i.e. available +labs). Especially if you run a LTSP thin client server, your +administration costs tend towards zero.
+ +What do you see as the disadvantages of Skolelinux/Debian +Edu?
+ +While Debian's stability has loads of advantages for servers, this +might be different in some cases for clients: Schools with unlimited +budget might buy new hardware with components that are not yet +supported by Debian stable, or wish to use more recent versions of +office packages or desktop environments. These schools have the +option to run Debian testing or other distributions - if they have the +capacity to do so. Another issue is that Debian release cycles +include a wide range of changes; therefor a high percentage of human +power seems to be absorbed by just keeping the features of Skolelinux +within the new setting of the version to come. During this process, +the cogs of Debian Edu are getting more and more professional, +i.e. harder to understand for novices.
+ +Which free software do you use daily?
+ +LibreOffice, Wikipedia, Openstreetmap, Iceweasel (Mozilla Firefox), +KMail, Gimp, Inkscape - and of course the Linux Kernel (not only on +PC, Laptop, Mobile, but also our SAT receiver)
+ +Which strategy do you believe is the right one to use to +get schools to use free software?
+ +-
+
+
- Support computer science as regular subject in schools to make +people really "own" their hardware, to make them understand the +difference between proprietary software products, and free software +developing. + +
- Make budget baskets corresponding: In Germany's public schools +there are more or less fixed budgets for IT equipment (including +licenses), so schools won't benefit from any savings here. This +privilege is left to private schools which have consequently a large +share among German Skolelinux schools. + +
- Get free software in the seminars where would-be teachers are +trained. In many cases, teachers' software customs are respected by +decision makers rather than the expertise of any IT experts. + +
- Don't limit ourself to free software run natively. Everybody uses +free software or free licenses (for instance Wikipedia), and this +general concept should get expanded to free educational content to be +shared world wide (school books e.g.). + +
- Make clear where ever you can that the market share of free (libre) +office suites is much above 20 p.c. today, and that you pupils don't +need to know the "ribbon menu" in order to get employed. + +
- Talk about the difference between freeware and free software. + +
- Spread free software, or even collections of portable free apps +for USB pen drives. Endorse students to get a legal copy of +Libreoffice rather than accepting them to use illegal serials. And +keep sending documents in ODF formats. + +
I just come across a blog post from Glyn Moody reporting the +claimed cost from Microsoft on requiring ODF to be used by the UK +government. I just sent him an email to let him know that his +assumption are most likely wrong. Sharing it here in case some of my +blog readers have seem the same numbers float around in the UK.
+ ++ +Hi. I just noted your +http://blogs.computerworlduk.com/open-enterprise/2012/04/does-microsoft-office-lock-in-cost-the-uk-government-500-million/index.htm +comment:
+ +"They're all in Danish, not unreasonably, but even +with the help of Google Translate I can't find any figures about the +savings of "moving to a flexible two standard" as claimed by the +Microsoft email. But I assume it is backed up somewhere, so let's take +it, and the £500 million figure for the UK, on trust." ++ +I can tell you that the Danish reports are inflated. I believe it is +the same reports that were used in the Norwegian debate around 2007, +and Gisle Hannemyr (a well known IT commentator in Norway) had a look +at the content. In short, the reason it is claimed that using ODF +will be so costly, is based on the assumption that this mean every +existing document need to be converted from one of the MS Office +formats to ODF, transferred to the receiver, and converted back from +ODF to one of the MS Office formats, and that the conversion will cost +10 minutes of work time for both the sender and the receiver. In +reality the sender would have a tool capable of saving to ODF, and the +receiver would have a tool capable of reading it, and the time spent +would at most be a few seconds for saving and loading, not 20 minutes +of wasted effort.
+ +Microsoft claimed all these costs were saved by allowing people to +transfer the original files from MS Office instead of spending 10 +minutes converting to ODF. :)
+ +See +http://hannemyr.com/no/ms12_vl02.php +and +http://hannemyr.com/no/ms12.php +for background information. Norwegian only, sorry. :)
+
De siste dagene har høringsuttalelsene om DIFIs forslag til +standardkatalog v3.1 blitt +publisert +på DIFIs nettside, og jeg kunne der glede meg over at +NUUGs +uttalelse er kommet med. En uttalelse som overrasker og forvirrer meg +er +den +fra Norges Blindeforbund, som 5 år etter at Klaus Knopper sammen +med sin blinde kone blant annet +demonstrerte +høyttalende OpenOffice.org på nynorsk for blinde på et NUUG-møte.
+ +Norges Blindeforbund +skriver følgende, som for meg virker å være formulert på sviktende +grunnlag:
+ +++ +Bruk av fri programvare + +
I FRIPROGSENTERET, RAPPORT 2009-02: Universell utforming +http://www.kunnskapsbazaren.no/filer/Friprogsenteret-Rapport-Universell_utforming.pdf +sies det "Det finnes i dag ikke mange fri programvare-rammeverk eller +generelle løsninger som støtter tilgjengelighet eller som er +universelt utformet."
+ +Til tross for at det gjennom prinsippene i fri programvare åpnes +for større frihet til selv å påvirke programvareløsninger i retning av +universell utforming viser praksis at virkeligheten er en annen. +Mange av de mest alminnelige frie programvarepakkene mangler delvis +eller fullstendig tilgjengelighet for mennesker med nedsatt +syn. Eksempler på dette er OpenOffice og LibreOffice m.fl.
+ +En annen utfordring ved bruk av fri programvare kan være manglende +kundestøtte og muligheter til opplæring i bruk av løsningen. Svaksynte +og blinde har et høyere behov for denne typen støtte enn andre brukere +ettersom mange av dem har behov for tilleggsprogramvare som skal +fungere sammen med den opprinnelige programvaren, og ettersom man ikke +har de samme muligheter for overblikk over grensesnittet som en seende +bruker. I tillegg til dette kommer de mer tilgjengelighetstekniske +utfordringene som ofte må løses i samarbeid med +programvareleverandør/produsent.
+ +Fri programvare er ikke på samme måte underlagt lovgivning gjennom +for eksempel diskriminerings og tilgjengelighetsloven ettersom det +ikke alltid finnes en produsent/tilbyder av tjenesten eller produktet.
+ +Norges Blindeforbund krever at universell utforming og +brukskvalitet tas med som viktige hensyn i utredninger som ligger til +grunn for valg av standarder som primært leder brukeren mot fri +programvare. Et eksempel pÃ¥ dette er bruk av dokumentformatet ODF som +leder brukeren i retning av OpenOffice, som er helt eller delvis +utilgjengelig for svaksynte og blinde â noe avhengig av plattform og +hjelpemiddelprogramvare.
+ +
Jeg håper noen involvert i OpenOffice.org og/eller LibreOffice tar +kontakt med Norges Blindeforbund og oppklarer det som for meg virker å +være en misforståelse, i og med at OpenOffice.org så vidt jeg vet +fungerer fint også for blinde.
+ +Jeg ble minnet på problemstillingen da jeg leste Slashdot-saken om +"The +State of Linux Accessibility", som også hevder at Linux fungerer +utmerket for blinde.
+ +De siste dagene har høringsuttalelsene om DIFIs forslag til -standardkatalog v3.1 blitt -publisert -på DIFIs nettside, og jeg kunne der glede meg over at -NUUGs -uttalelse er kommet med. En uttalelse som overrasker og forvirrer meg -er -den -fra Norges Blindeforbund, som 5 år etter at Klaus Knopper sammen -med sin blinde kone blant annet -demonstrerte -høyttalende OpenOffice.org på nynorsk for blinde på et NUUG-møte.
- -Norges Blindeforbund -skriver følgende, som for meg virker å være formulert på sviktende -grunnlag:
- --- -Bruk av fri programvare - -
I FRIPROGSENTERET, RAPPORT 2009-02: Universell utforming -http://www.kunnskapsbazaren.no/filer/Friprogsenteret-Rapport-Universell_utforming.pdf -sies det "Det finnes i dag ikke mange fri programvare-rammeverk eller -generelle løsninger som støtter tilgjengelighet eller som er -universelt utformet."
- -Til tross for at det gjennom prinsippene i fri programvare åpnes -for større frihet til selv å påvirke programvareløsninger i retning av -universell utforming viser praksis at virkeligheten er en annen. -Mange av de mest alminnelige frie programvarepakkene mangler delvis -eller fullstendig tilgjengelighet for mennesker med nedsatt -syn. Eksempler på dette er OpenOffice og LibreOffice m.fl.
- -En annen utfordring ved bruk av fri programvare kan være manglende -kundestøtte og muligheter til opplæring i bruk av løsningen. Svaksynte -og blinde har et høyere behov for denne typen støtte enn andre brukere -ettersom mange av dem har behov for tilleggsprogramvare som skal -fungere sammen med den opprinnelige programvaren, og ettersom man ikke -har de samme muligheter for overblikk over grensesnittet som en seende -bruker. I tillegg til dette kommer de mer tilgjengelighetstekniske -utfordringene som ofte må løses i samarbeid med -programvareleverandør/produsent.
- -Fri programvare er ikke på samme måte underlagt lovgivning gjennom -for eksempel diskriminerings og tilgjengelighetsloven ettersom det -ikke alltid finnes en produsent/tilbyder av tjenesten eller produktet.
- -Norges Blindeforbund krever at universell utforming og -brukskvalitet tas med som viktige hensyn i utredninger som ligger til -grunn for valg av standarder som primært leder brukeren mot fri -programvare. Et eksempel pÃ¥ dette er bruk av dokumentformatet ODF som -leder brukeren i retning av OpenOffice, som er helt eller delvis -utilgjengelig for svaksynte og blinde â noe avhengig av plattform og -hjelpemiddelprogramvare.
- -
Jeg håper noen involvert i OpenOffice.org og/eller LibreOffice tar -kontakt med Norges Blindeforbund og oppklarer det som for meg virker å -være en misforståelse, i og med at OpenOffice.org så vidt jeg vet -fungerer fint også for blinde.
- -Jeg ble minnet på problemstillingen da jeg leste Slashdot-saken om -"The -State of Linux Accessibility", som også hevder at Linux fungerer -utmerket for blinde.
- -I just come across a blog post from Glyn Moody reporting the -claimed cost from Microsoft on requiring ODF to be used by the UK -government. I just sent him an email to let him know that his -assumption are most likely wrong. Sharing it here in case some of my -blog readers have seem the same numbers float around in the UK.
- -Hi. I just noted your -http://blogs.computerworlduk.com/open-enterprise/2012/04/does-microsoft-office-lock-in-cost-the-uk-government-500-million/index.htm -comment:
+In january, I +discovered +the ColorHug, a USB dongle from +Hughski to calibrate +the color on a computer screen. The software required is +included +in Debian, and I decided back then to preorder from the next +batch. Yesterday I finally heard back from them, and got the +opportunity to order. Today I ordered mine, and eagerly await the +delivery. I hope it arrive next week, as I got a confirmation that it +should go in the mail on monday. :)
-"They're all in Danish, not unreasonably, but even -with the help of Google Translate I can't find any figures about the -savings of "moving to a flexible two standard" as claimed by the -Microsoft email. But I assume it is backed up somewhere, so let's take -it, and the £500 million figure for the UK, on trust." -+If you want to ensure the colors on the screen match the intended +colors, I suggest you check out this cheap tool with free software +drivers. :)
-I can tell you that the Danish reports are inflated. I believe it is -the same reports that were used in the Norwegian debate around 2007, -and Gisle Hannemyr (a well known IT commentator in Norway) had a look -at the content. In short, the reason it is claimed that using ODF -will be so costly, is based on the assumption that this mean every -existing document need to be converted from one of the MS Office -formats to ODF, transferred to the receiver, and converted back from -ODF to one of the MS Office formats, and that the conversion will cost -10 minutes of work time for both the sender and the receiver. In -reality the sender would have a tool capable of saving to ODF, and the -receiver would have a tool capable of reading it, and the time spent -would at most be a few seconds for saving and loading, not 20 minutes -of wasted effort.
+
Peter Hidas fra Gartner melder i Computerworld at +Unix +nedkjempes av Linux og Windows. For meg er påstanden meningsløs, +da Linux er en variant av Unix, og hele diskusjonen om Linux er Unix +eller ikke er utdatert og uinteressant. Jeg ser at Helge Skrivervik +deler mitt syn på saken i sin kommentar fra i går om at +"Unix vs. Linux += uinteressant".
-Microsoft claimed all these costs were saved by allowing people to -transfer the original files from MS Office instead of spending 10 -minutes converting to ODF. :)
+I NUUG-sammenheng møter jeg av og +til folk som tror NUUG er for avdankede folk som driver med den samme +Unix-varianten som Peter Hidas skriver om i sin kommentar, og dermed +er en foreningen for avdankede teknologer interessert i døende +teknologi. Intet kunne være lengre fra sannheten.
-See -http://hannemyr.com/no/ms12_vl02.php -and -http://hannemyr.com/no/ms12.php -for background information. Norwegian only, sorry. :)
- +NUUG er en forening for oss som har sans for fri programvare, åpne +standarder og Unix-lignende operativsystemer, som Ubuntu, FreeBSD, +Debian, Mint, Gentoo, Android, Gnome, KDE, LXDE, Firefox, LibreOffice, +ODF, HTML, C++, ECMA-Script, etc. Kort sagt der nyskapning skjer på +IT-fronten i dag. Det innebærer selvfølgelig også de som er +interessert i de "gamle" Unix-ene som Solaris og HP-UX, men de er bare +et lite mindretall blant NUUGs medlemmer. De aller fleste medlemmene +har i dag fokus på Linux.
In 2003, a German teacher showed up on the -Debian Edu and Skolelinux -mailing list with interesting problems and reports proving he setting -up Linux for a (for us at the time) lot of pupiles. His name was Ralf -Gesellensetter, and he have been an important tester and contributor -since then, helping to make sure the -Debian Edu -Squeeze release became as good as it is..
+It has been a few busy weeks for me, but I am finally back to +publish another interview with the people behind +Debian Edu and Skolelinux. +This time it is one of our German developers, who have helped out over the +years to make sure both a lot of major but also a lot of the minor +details get right before release.
Who are you, and how do you spend your days?
-I am a teacher from Germany, and my subjects are Geography, -Mathematics, and Computer Science ("Informatik"). During the past 12 -years (since 2000), I have been working for a comprehensive (and soon, -also inclusive) school leading to all kind of general levels, such as -O- or A-level ("Abitur"). For quite as long, I've been taking care of -our computer network.
+My name is Jürgen Leibner, I'm 49 years old and living in +Bielefeld, a town in northern Germany. I worked nearly 20 years as +certified engineer in the department for plant design and layout of an +international company for machinery and equipment. Since 2011 I'm a +certified technical writer (tekom e.V.) and doing technical +documentations for a steam turbine manufacturer. From April this year +I will manage the department of technical documentation at a +manufacturer of automation and assembly line engineering.
-Now, in my early 40s, I enjoy the privilege of spending a lot of my -spare time together with my wife, our son (3 years) and our daughter -(4 months).
+My first contact with linux was around 1993. Since that time I used +it at work and at home repeatedly but not exclusively as I do now at +home since 2006.
How did you get in contact with the Skolelinux/Debian Edu project?
-We had tried different Linux based school servers, when members of -my local Linux User Group (LUG OWL) detected Skolelinux. I remember -very well, being part of a party celebrating the Linux New Media Award -("Best Newcomer Distribution", also nominated: Ubuntu) that was given -to Skolelinux at Linux World Exposition in Frankfurt, 2005 (IIRC). Few -months later, I had the chance to join a developer meeting in Ulsrud -(Oslo) and to hand out the award to Knut Yrvin and others. For more -than 7 years, Skolelinux is part of our schools infrastructure, namely -our main server (tjener), one LTSP (today without thin clients), and -approximately 50 work stations. Most of these have the option to boot a -locally installed Skolelinux image. As a consequence, I joined quite -a few events dealing with free software or Linux, and met many Debian -(Edu) developers. All of them seemed quite nice and competent to me, -one more reason to stick to Skolelinux.
+Once a day in the early year of 2001 when I wanted to fetch my +daughter from primary school, there was a teacher sitting in the +middle of 20 old computers trying to boot them and he failed. I helped +him to get them booting. That was seen by the school director and she +asked me if I would like to manage that the school gets all that old +computers in use. I answered: "Yes".
+ +Some weeks later every of the 10 classrooms had one computer +running Windows98. I began to collect old computers and equipment as +gifts and installed the first computer room with a peer-to-peer +network. I did my work at school without being payed in my spare time +and with a lot of fun. About one year later the school was connected +to Internet and a local area network was installed in the school +building. That was the time to have a server and I knew it must be a +Linux server to be able to fulfil all the wishes of the teachers and +being able to do this in a transparent and economic way, without extra +costs for things like licence and software. So I searched for a +school server system running under Linux and I found a couple of +people nearby who founded 'skolelinux.de'. It was the Skolelinux +prerelease 32 I first tried out for being used at the school. I +managed the IT of that school until the municipal authority took over +the IT management and centralised the services for all schools in +Bielefeld in December of 2006.
What do you see as the advantages of Skolelinux/Debian Edu?
-Debian driven, you are given all the advantages of a community -project including well maintained updates. Once, you are familiar with -the network layout, you can easily roll out an entire educational -computer infrastructure, from just one installation media. As only -free software (FOSS) is used, that supports even elderly hardware, -up-sizing your IT equipment is only limited by space (i.e. available -labs). Especially if you run a LTSP thin client server, your -administration costs tend towards zero.
+When I'm looking back to the beginning, there were other advantages +for me as today.
-What do you see as the disadvantages of Skolelinux/Debian -Edu?
+In the past there were advantages like:
-While Debian's stability has loads of advantages for servers, this -might be different in some cases for clients: Schools with unlimited -budget might buy new hardware with components that are not yet -supported by Debian stable, or wish to use more recent versions of -office packages or desktop environments. These schools have the -option to run Debian testing or other distributions - if they have the -capacity to do so. Another issue is that Debian release cycles -include a wide range of changes; therefor a high percentage of human -power seems to be absorbed by just keeping the features of Skolelinux -within the new setting of the version to come. During this process, -the cogs of Debian Edu are getting more and more professional, -i.e. harder to understand for novices.
+-
-
- I don't need to buy it so it generates no costs to the school as +they had little money to spent for computers and software. -
- It has a licence which grands all rights to use it without +cost. -
- It was more able to fit all requirements of a server system for +schools than a Microsoft server system, even if there are only Windows +clients because of it's preconfigured overall concept of being a +infrastructure solution and community for schools, not only a +server -
- I was able to configure the server to the needs of the +school. + +
Which free software do you use daily?
+LibreOffice, Wikipedia, Openstreetmap, Iceweasel (Mozilla Firefox), -KMail, Gimp, Inkscape - and of course the Linux Kernel (not only on -PC, Laptop, Mobile, but also our SAT receiver)
+Which strategy do you believe is the right one to use to -get schools to use free software?
+-
+
Today some of the advantages has been lost, changed or new ones +came up in this way:
+ +-
+
+
- Most schools here do have money to buy hardware and software +now. + +
- They are today mostly managed from central IT departments which +have own concepts which often do not fit to Debian Edu concepts +because they are to close to Microsoft ideology. + +
- With the Squeeze version of Debian Edu which now uses GOsa² for +management I feel more able to manage the daily tasks than with the +interfaces used in the past. + +
- It is more modular than in the past and fits even better to the +different needs. + +
- The documentation is usable and gets better every day. + +
- More people than ever before are using Debian Edu all over the +world and so the community, which is an very important part I think, +is sharing knowledge and minds. + +
- Most, maybe all, of the technical requirements for schools are +solved today by Debian Edu. + +
What do you see as the disadvantages of Skolelinux/Debian +Edu?
+ +-
+
+
- There are too few IT companies able to integrate Debian Edu into +their product portfolio for serving schools with concepts or even +whole municipality areas. -
- Support computer science as regular subject in schools to make -people really "own" their hardware, to make them understand the -difference between proprietary software products, and free software -developing. +
- Debian Edu has beside other free and open software projects not +enough lobbyists which promote free and open software to +politicians. -
- Make budget baskets corresponding: In Germany's public schools -there are more or less fixed budgets for IT equipment (including -licenses), so schools won't benefit from any savings here. This -privilege is left to private schools which have consequently a large -share among German Skolelinux schools. +
- Technically there are no disadvantages I'm aware of. -
- Get free software in the seminars where would-be teachers are -trained. In many cases, teachers' software customs are respected by -decision makers rather than the expertise of any IT experts. +
Which free software do you use daily?
-I use Debian stable on my home server and on my little desktop +computer. On my laptop I use Debian testing/sid. The applications I +use on my laptop and my desktop are Open/Libre-office, Iceweasel, +KMail, DigiKam, Amarok, Dolphin, okular and all the other programs I +need from the KDE environment. On console I use newsbeuter, mutt, +screen, irssi and all the other famous and useful tools.
-My home server provides mail services with exim, dovecot, roundcube +and mutt over ssh on the console, file services with samba, NFS, +rsync, web services with apache, moinmoin-wiki, multimedia services +with gallery2 and mediatomb and database services with MySQL for me +and the whole family. I probably forgot something.
-Which strategy do you believe is the right one to use to +get schools to use free software?
- +I believe, we should provide concepts for IT companies to integrate +Debian Edu into their product portfolio with use cases for different +countries and areas all over the world.